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Indie Initiative OVER???????

Tupelo 16 Sep 2003 21:42

What the fuck?
It's wrong... I understand the venues position, gotta keep the doors open, but it's a big loss. Neil gave my band a go in Feb this year, and that one Thurs nite gig resulted in 4 more at the Espy and others at Armadale, Underpass & Dan O C (all from that initial exposure). It a great platform for unsigned bands to get exposure, and it's a damn shame to lose that. Well done Neil for your efforts, I look forward to the next chapter........</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Looie 16 Sep 2003 22:29

So,so wrong.Neil,what you have done for so many bands is incredible.Shame Espy,Shame!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


LionelHutz 17 Sep 2003 08:32

This is a sad day for Melbourne Music. The Indie Initiative provided my band wtih some of our best gigs and helped expose us to and meet some great people in the local music scene. Fantastic job Neil. Any chance that the Indie Initiative will move to another venue in the future?</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 17 Sep 2003 09:43

I hope to move it but it may have to take a different format. Probably a door charge with the bands keeping money from the pre sales, much like the weekend shows at the Espy.
The disappointment for me is that whilst it doesn't make make money for the Espy, the follow up shows make them money.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Electro 17 Sep 2003 11:58

Really sad to hear about developments at the Espy. It would be sad to move to a venue where a cover charge was needed (though this I know is reality).One of the huge difficluties as a 'starting off' band, and as someone who used to regularly book a night at a melbourne pub, is getting people through the door when they have to pay money for bands they don't know, even if it is only a few dollars. But, the other side of the coin (pun intended, I'm afraid) is bands getting paid $50 a set (plus rider) as that is all most venues are prepaired to do for unknowns. having a cover does reduce the ability for people to also just drop in and network.

It's a difficult question, though with all the amazing work Neil has done in the past, I have to admit to having faith that a solution will be found (not meaning to put the pressure on!)

Till then, keep on doing whatever it is that you do - It's worth it.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


fantasic 17 Sep 2003 13:01

Sad day for the Melbourne Music Scene and for all the unknown bands and starting off bands in and around Melbourne. To everyone that has played the Indie Initiative gig or has just went down to check out a band or two. Go along to this Thursday gig and show your support give Niel a hand shake and say Thanx.

Thanx Heaps Niel for all your hard work and dedication to one of the most greatest nights that a small band could have!!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


paulraygun 17 Sep 2003 13:04

more people should have shown up then and drunk more and made more for the espy. too late to cry now.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


TheNamesake 17 Sep 2003 13:12

Unfortunate. Four weeks after my band sends Neil a demo, the thing closes. Typical. :-( Good luck with your next move, Neil, and we'll see you Thursday night. Sincerely, Jaymz - The Namesake</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


ocelots 17 Sep 2003 13:41

What a Shame. We were one of the bands to play on the last Friday nights. The Feedback was great. Even the next day we had a email from a record company interested in talking to us. Indie Initative was a great gig. I hope you start another one Neil. Thanks for all your hard work we will look forward to what happens next
Cheers
The Ocelots</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


tomnhnl 17 Sep 2003 15:00

i'm in talks with a fitzroy venue to run a night similar to indie initiative. I will post details here as soon as things are confirmed.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


TAUNT 17 Sep 2003 16:22

What a shame to hear Neil, this is a huge blow to the many 100's of up and coming Melbourne bands itching to play at one of the city's highest profiled live venues in which (as our case) you gave an opportunity to perform at. This night offered us an EP Launch in front of 607 punters an experience we'll never bloody forget!!!! A huge thank-you for all the help and guidance you have given us and many, many others over the years. Until the next generation of these Initiative Nights! Cheers Neil - TAUNT.
</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


paulraygun 17 Sep 2003 16:30

maybe an extra incentive at first to get more people along. how about cheaper drinks etc etc..

it seams that a lot of people bring their crowd, however they just seem to come along to see that particular band and a lot leave soon after. need to start drawing more people in who want to see bands other than their friends.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


TheAnimal 18 Sep 2003 13:42

Thanks Neil for the opportunity for us to play our music @ indie initiative @ The Espy. Disappointed at what has unfolded but will remember.
Regards,
20minuteS.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


ZeddES 18 Sep 2003 13:51

Condolenses to Neil and crew. The III ran well at the Espy, and what a venue to host it. The way you ran the night Neil was almost too good to be true.... I mean free entry for punters, one of THE BEST venues in the country to play at, and we got paid for the priviledge!! I for one would have been more than happy to play the Gershwin room for NOTHING!!! I also don't think that numbers through the door would have been all that different if punters had to pay a coupla bucks to get in. Nevermind,.. like you said Neil, it means time for change,..time to move on. If, and when you get a new venue, consider bands playing for less pay,.. punters being asked for an honest donation maybe.... rather than a fixed cover. Honest people will pay a couple of dollars to see bands, and some of the talent that is around this great city of ours sure deserves it! I have faith Neil.... it's not all that long ago that the Greyhound Hotel kicked of the IndieInitiative, and it's only gone from strength to strength!! We all look forward to the next chapter, and until then you have our full support!! Once again, a huge thanks for the oportunities you have given us to now.
Mark
- Emerald Sea.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Alias 18 Sep 2003 14:02

Musicians can only blame themselves for this outcome. If every band member that set foot on the Gershwin stage on a Thursday night had 15 people in the room supporting them, this would never of happened.

The problem with bands is that they don't support other bands.

Just imagine if 3 bands played in one night (with 4 members in each band), and each individual band member had 15 friends or family attend the gig?

Thatís 180 people every Thursday night supporting the Indi Initiative.

Bands have got to start taking responsibility for their own industry. The more people they get to gigs the healthier the industry will be for all bands.

In a sence, bands deserve this outcome!


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Electro 18 Sep 2003 17:12

I have to disagree with Alias. I also used to take the line that people in bands should make more effort, but I have managed a great band who made huge efforts and played big gigs at the Corner etc, but when you are playing 2-3 gigs a month (which is often important to do) you can't drag the same 50 people down each time. Part of the problem for some of the amazing but struggling bands out there is gaining that critical mass that you aren't harrasing people just to turn up so you can play. I think the public in general (so many of who cliam to love live music) are either not as interested as they claim, for the number of great bands in Melbourne, or they only turn up to names they know. That is why indie initiative was so great. A chance to sample new things. I think people in bands, or who are really interested need to get off there couches more, and down to venues when soemthing like II is happening. I try at least once a month to catch a band I have never heard of before. Some might be crap, but some are great. That was part of what was so good about the II, it was all there, for bands and punters alike.

So Keep popping, rocking, or whatever it is you do, and get out there

Electro</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 18 Sep 2003 18:01

It's a chicken and egg situation.
Bands must make an effort to get people along. Important gigs require dragging people out.
Bands need to go out to gigs to see other bands play, maybe find other bands to play with and enjoy themselves. I think there are about 3000 bands in Victoria. That makes about 15000 musicians. With friends hopefully.
Musicians influence other people. Thus if all musicians were attending one gig a week then thats big crowds.
If musicians are enthusiastic then their friends will eventually come along.
There is no magic wand. It is hard work. Melbourne has one of the great music scenes in the world because bands and promoters/bookers are keen. Venues keep keen because of the hard work done by bands and bookers.
Venues see the rewards they can get. Contrast that to Sydney which is basically run by large booking agencies booking bands in to venues run by large venue booking agencies.
You get what you deserve.
Just keep working at it. But work smart.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


paulraygun 18 Sep 2003 20:52

where ever the indie initiative moves to, i know i will be checking out some bands, and putting in some reviews. ive seen some amazing bands there, and i know there will be more.

maybe there needs to be a review on how it is all conducted and what can be done to make it better and spread the word a bit more.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


SongDog 18 Sep 2003 21:41

Best Gig we've played Biggest Gig we've played, got payed, got pissed. Our song played on radio and our heads in Inpress. Thanks for your support, Neil. You can expect ours.
THIRD ARM</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Dimmage 25 Sep 2003 16:48

Don't mean to repeat what everyone else has said, but thanks Neil for all your work, our band also played some of our best gigs at the indie initiative, and gained a lot of experience not only from the musical point of view, but also from the promotional and business point of view due to the many articles, feedback and support offered. The night will certainly be missed, but we look forward to seeing what happens next...

Hollow Imagery</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


sydneyscene 6 Oct 2003 13:04

hey neil, you have done so much for the melbourne scene its unbelievable to see from a Sydney perspective. Here we don't have much. HOWEVER being in a band one thing i notice is there is a lot of young people in the industry now that are really keen to promote music and its not for the money (because there is none) they just love the music.

I am a member of the COG street team and that band have changed the face of a lot of the sydney gigs with a real vibe of people coming together into music. The booking agency behind them are awesome and they always reply to emails and always want to hear our bands progress and give honest feedback. i think there is always people that dont care out there but that is my example of a band that cares about fans and a large company that takes time out to care.

join cog street team: www.cog.com.au
or TPA street team: www.tpa.net.au

check out this cool bands: www.stayingathome.cjb.net</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MrLoud 10 Oct 2003 14:43

Ditto to Tupelo's post. Do you have anything to do with Public Bar bookings or the Espy for that fact, any longer Neil?</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 10 Oct 2003 16:57

No, I don't. But the best way to work with Trish is to have a lineup together and send her an offer. Back it up with what you have done in the past and see how it goes from there.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


pipefitter 13 Oct 2003 18:19

The whole dragging all your friends to the gig is really a catch 22 situation. I mean you can drag em along but are you really building a fanbase? You can tell the difference between friends in the audience, and then a bona fide fan base like COG have.

I think Melbourne does get a bit over rated because there simply is not enough people really really interested in supporting bands or venues. The only time people do is if the venue is going to get knocked down.

If there is going to be a change in this scene just open up your beat magazine, find a random band and check them out. If people started doing this once a week, then we the bands, and punters will notice a huge difference in the scene. More people at venues, more bands can play, more bands signed, more on the radio. Then hopefully one day we can live in a society like Japan where around 80% of the content on the radio is homegrown.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Alias 15 Oct 2003 13:40

Dragging your friends down to an ĎIndie Initiativeí gig is not a catch 22 situation. It makes perfect sense for a band in their early stages of development trying to build a bona fide fan base.

Yes you can tell the difference between family and friends in the crowd, but the fact is a crowd attracts a crowd and attention. And look at it from the venueís perspective, do you really think the Espy care weather there are 180 friends drinking beer or 180 bona fide fanís drinking beer?

Itís really simpleÖ.

The more friends and family you get to gigs, the more money the venues will make.

The more money the venues make, the more they will support and promote original live music.

The more they promote original live music, the healthier the industry will become and weíll see a rise in the number of bona fide supporters out their supporting bands.

The more fans that come to gigs the more money bands make.

The fact is if people donít come to gigs, venues arenít making money. And if venues arenít making money they will stop providing live original music. Every time a band plays a gig they should be aiming to bring around 15 people per band member.

Lets start supporting the people that give us the opportunity to perform.
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planetx 15 Oct 2003 17:44

Well said Alias. It is a business and more bands should start treating that way - instead of thinking fans magically appear. There are many levels to think about regarding your performance, unfortunately its no longer just about the music. (don't think it ever was anyway:) ).
If your booking a show with another band - be sure they can pull a crowd too. This will ensure the bar is happy and ultimately the manager will be. Hey, you may even get some new fans out of it for your next gig......</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


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