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Venue Bookers: The Good, Bad & the Useless..

MrLoud 25 Oct 2004 16:50

Just as a matter of curiosity, I would like peoples thoughts regarding Venue bookers here in Melbourne / Victoria, but not limited to.
This shouldn't be a witch hunt to expose the "Wanna Be's" but more of an informative knowledge share with people either in bands or associated with bookings.
We have to keep in mind people approach their jobs differently and deal with people and situations differently, however the end result should be either a successful booking or a 'no thanks'.

This may help bands approach known venues when booking and expectations of how the booker(s) will take onboard the bands request.

Suggested format, Venue, night of performance, Booker and experience.

Again, please lets keep it clean and try your hardest not abuse individuals.

.... please discuss</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


verbatim 8 Nov 2004 12:11

gavin purdy is useless(espy)</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 8 Nov 2004 22:28

Try taking 100 phone calls a day and satisfying every bands need to play. Then deal with the guys who run the place.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


beachball 9 Nov 2004 10:58

Isn't that what a band booker is paid to do????????</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MrLoud 9 Nov 2004 12:43

Neil, surprisingly this is not the first complaint about Gavan. Regardless of how many calls, emails whatever.... a courteous call back informing the band I have recieved your stuff is always appreciated. Also with that it may reduce his 100 calls p/day.
It is his job and it should not come as a surprise considering the venue he is supposedly 'working' for.
Scot on the other hand is very helpful.....</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


chickstar 9 Nov 2004 16:53

You are right on the money beachball. A bookers job is to organise lineups, and contact bands. I am sooo sick of bookers who put the onus back on the band to get a line up together, not calling back, or your band is booked to play but it may be 95% confirmed (Duke Of Windsor), then you find out things have changed, without you having a say. IT IS NOT HARD TO BOOK A VENUE. If you are an organised person, you can take the "100 calls" a day, or whatever is thrown your way. There are too many people in this industry who are amateurish.....don't get me started on dodgy band comps either....Launchpad being one of them</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 10 Nov 2004 10:58

If you want a response send a stamped self addressed envolope so they can return the CD to you. That way you might stand out and they would take the time. I got 8 CD's today. I'm listening to them and sending off replies to all today. But I don't have the phone ringing all day.
Most of you could not book a venue, and for all the fantasies about what you would do the cold hard reality is different.
If you want a response propose a lineup and how you are going to promote it. One little band doesn't have a huge chance, a group of bands has a better chance. Prove you can get a crowd on a hard night and it becomes easier. Come down to the Indie Initiative nights and see bands you might like to get involved with. Getting a gig at the II is a stepping stone to other gigs.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MasterB8 10 Nov 2004 11:45

The fact is Neil, regardless of how difficult their job is, some bookers are better than others, and I agree Gavin is poor. He is rude, dismissive, and unprofessional. 100 calls a day? Big deal! Trish was easily taking that many, and she was never anything but a gem to talk to.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


chickstar 10 Nov 2004 12:04

Right on Master B8! Gee, how about getting into the office a little earlier than after midday, then some of these "so called" bookers can get their work done-it ain't hard. And Neil, no maybe some of us can't book venues-but there are some of us out here who can....and would probably do a better job than some who are booking the gig.....I find it quite funny that now 2 people are doing Trish's job at the espy-and still can't get it right!!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


chickstar 10 Nov 2004 14:19

Hello kiddies, get this.....Alpha State, Nullenvoid , Nitidus & 5 Star Prison Cell has a gig on the 18th Dec at Duke Of Windsor which is an ep launch for Alpha & possibly 5 Star. The gig has been booked for 2 mths at least...but now we have been blown out cos Riff Random are back in town and need a gig and supposedly the pub has been supporting them. Also DOW doesn't want to support 'heavier bands'-apparently the pub has been getting a 'reputation' for having heavy bands, and don't want it. How fucking wrong is that?! Besides the fact that all bands have done/doing promo, getting your cd pressed in time for your launch-this is from the owner. NOT GOOD ENOUGH</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MrLoud 10 Nov 2004 15:08

That is very poor form, not surprising, but very very bad form.

WTF can bands do in this scenario? Put up with it? After promo and effort..... sign legal contracts? Give me a break.


Neil, ur thoughts?</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


DaJones 10 Nov 2004 16:54

Coming from a Sydney perspective trying to book Melbourne gigs, nothing much is easy in Melbourne full stop. Every bit of abuse coming from above is consistent with the Melbourne booking reputation (and I know some Perth bands who think somilarly), especially one particular booker mentioned numerous times above. I too got zero love. However help has come from Neil as we have booked a gig with him, and Nathalie from Rob Roy was more helpful than most but unfortunately shit hit the fan there with that venue. But as Neil said above, the best way it seems is to go to bookers with a full bill set up. However here lies the main problem - with every booker I asked them for some help with suggesting like-minded bands to contact but the level of help was basically none. Moral of the story - screw trying the contact the bookers and find allies inthe bands themselves. Anyone who needs help in Sydney- let me know if you want to do the same for us in Melbourne</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


chickstar 10 Nov 2004 17:30

Unfortunately Mr.Loud, contracts are only signed if you are a "touring band"/or have signed with Premier, Harbour, TPA, and companies of such ilk. Bookers laugh at you when you mention contract or agreement. It's funny in other industries how you can sue for loss of projected income, unfortunately the music industry is an entity of it's own, and if you have power & the money, it's surprising how quickly situations can change. Unless the Arts & Media Alliance can kick up a stink about it, or a musicians union (HA), there is little much that we can do, other than do your research, talk to people who are actually doing something active in the industry for advice, or talk to other bands who have played the venue before, ask them is there anything we need to know about the venue/booker, and then make your decision. Just touching on my last point on no 'heavy bands' at DOW, I'm going to love the day when our genre comes round big time, and being able to 'snub' the little venues, who didnt support you in the first place, and yes, our genre is coming back. If they werent so caught up in whats actually popular now, and looked down the track a bit, the pub would be set for the future.....little mind syndrome</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 11 Nov 2004 00:50

If you got blown out ask for another date. Ask for compensation for the promotion you have done.
Ask for a contract to be signed. Send them a contract or a booking form and ask for a confirmation.
If you can't even find bands to play with how could you book a venue?
Go out and find bands by going to gigs. If 100 band members came on either Wed or Thu to the II then we would be full every week and our special events would be at the Prince. If you slackers don't support each other how can you expect others to support you.
If you were all getting 100 or 200 people to your gigs you wouldn't get blown out.
I've got about 1000 bands on my email list. Thats about 5000 band members. If I see 20 at any gig I'm amazed.
Why don't you get together, come down the pub, have a couple of drinks, see some bands, do some bonding and help support live music. It's fine to see bigger bands as many of you do but only by supporting each other will you get a chance to grow.
Bookers pay more attention if you are getting big crowds.
Support the MusicMob, support the II and things might happen.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Jemwitch 11 Nov 2004 10:53

Probably because between playing your own shows, rehearsing twice a week, working 5 days a week and going to see your mates shows that don't have the status behind them like II (hence less numbers) there is very little time to get anywhere else. Not excusing, just suggesting. I can't remeber the last free thursday night i had and i've been rehearsing tue, wed for the last 3 years.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 11 Nov 2004 11:14

Rehearsal is all fine, but its more important to see bands and learn from what other people are doing. If you see bands you like you can play with them. Another rehearsal probably won't change your musical future but seeing a band may well do it.
My life changed because I went to a gig in Perth, recognised Ken West (BDO organiser) from gigs I'd seen him at in Melbourne and got to promote New Order. I used to be a computer programmer. I've booked lots of venues and worked with lots of wonderful bands. All from a meeting at a gig.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Old54 11 Nov 2004 13:15

In defence of Gavan Purdy. I was most impressed by him and all panel members at the recent Indie Initiative seminar. He spoke interestedly to me afterwards. I gave him a CD, then called him, spoke briefly, then followed up with two messages left on his answering machine. On both occasions he followed up by promptly ringing my mobile. On the second occasion we spoke at length and he offered a lot of insight into booking at the Espy.
He doesn't feel he can book my band, Jeff Jenkins' Late Starters, because of our age demographic - av.age 45. He hadn't yet listened to the CD, which was a shame, but I could understand his reasoning, ageist and all as it may seem.
So Neil is right; organise nights for yourselves, with a theme.
'Old heads, new sounds' is our theme, older musos playing 100% original music, at The Underpass, Saturday November 27 with Steve Romig as special guest.
It's aimed at 40+ audiences, but just like I enjoy young Indie Initiative bands, don't feel that 40+ is too old to rock'n'roll. Come along and hear the new music that's coming from those who've been continuously playing music since the 60s.
www.users.bigpond.com/jjlatestarters</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


sowhat 11 Nov 2004 14:35

there is nothing wrong with Gavan Purdy. He is a great booker with a better knowledge than most of what is good and what would work. he probably gets annoyed having to waste so much time filtering all the unsuitable or shit bands he has to deal with. Venues are a bussiness and cause ya want to play is fine but bills still have to be paid or tere are no venues. Doe's the trickle down theory work with the bigger bands... no cause they are protecting what they have put in place for themselves. It is about going out, seeing bands, networking and strong bills to interest people, and make sure your nand is not just another annoyance to a booker.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


catfishno1 11 Nov 2004 17:25

......as well as spelling and the proper use of grammar in forum posts.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


catfishno1 11 Nov 2004 17:28

writing sentences in forum posts that actually make sense would make your argument a lot stronger.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


voxvox 12 Nov 2004 13:14

Catfish, pull the carrot out of your arse.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Lebowski 12 Nov 2004 14:33

I have real mixed feelings about the bookers.

Without wishing to name names, some appear completely disorganised, some consitently have their phones switched off, others never call you back or respond to your emails and others promise you a gig - but it takes MONTHS to get an actual date out of them (if you're lucky!).

One particular venue never answers the phone, never replies to messages and their email address bounces back. I have been down to the venue a couple of times (of course the booker wasn't there) and they said "yes, he's very difficult to get hold of"!! Why is that??

Mostly you usually get the CBNW's (call back next week) which you do until you are both probably sick of eachother! If you can actually get hold of them that is...

Yet, I have had dealings with many bookers who are both courteous and friendly, spend time talking to you and do follow things through. Special "big up's" to Natalie at Empress and Trish at Greyhound!

I am aware it's a difficult job, but there is such an amazing difference in the attitude you come across...</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


shooga 12 Nov 2004 15:06

There is a strange wonderful peace that comes with just not giving a shit.

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MasterB8 12 Nov 2004 17:07

This topic is surreal. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MrLoud 12 Nov 2004 17:08

I think one issue is the prevelent mentality amongst certain bookers that a band is not a business. Some bookers only see you as an organic jukebox / thirst generator and fail to see the implications of them fucking you - the band around.
To a degree some bands may not see themselves in that light either, which I think is a problem, if you want to be serious and treated seriously, you have to come across as a serious band.
I don't have to explain what I mean by serious.!
With that I'm not saying anyone that has been fucked around isn't a serious band - not at all!!!
What I am saying is that the booker may have the wrong idea of your intentions and assume you can be changed whenever he/she suits. Lets not forget they probably get screwed by bands too from time to time.
Perhaps an approach (which we take and have much success) is outline your intentions of the night - How you are going to promo it - street mags, web, email.... even down to drink passes and VIP lists etc... Let them know you are laying down some dollars to promo. Involving the venue with your show has always worked for us and got us gigs again at the venue.
We've always taken a hard straight line with the booker, and if breaking their arse with phone calls, emails or whatever is what you have to do - DO IT, it is their job and if anything it shows them you are very keen and your not going to cancel last minute.
Obviously this is from the stand point where you've initially been contacted, so they consider your music suitable for a night at their venue.
ChickStar, I know what your saying re contracts too, my earlier post was more along the lines - its a sad day if to book a gig for an indie band has to resort to legal contract with some obscure little pub. It shouldn't/ doesn't have to be that hard.
Some great points have been raised... Like I said, name them, no need to insult though. Their names are public knowledge anyway - as are your bands!

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catfishno1 13 Nov 2004 00:41

Great comment voxvox. How about you make us aware of your true identity. I have no problems giving light hearted shit to people. "sowhat"'s comments had merits, they just didn't make any grammatical sense.

And yes, some band bookers are better than others. But, if you want a gig at a certain venue, you have to be willing to deal with the way the band booker operates. There isn't any point in whingeing about, it's just the way the cookie crumbles.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


beachball 13 Nov 2004 16:11

Over 10 years ago I had a stint booking bands at the Bendigo Hotel in Collingwood with some great bands and a healthy scene. And sure it was manic and mad but a real buzz when we had a full house and everyone was happy. Slowly the owners started cutting shows at short to NO notice for reasons unknown and the pub slid into "live" rock'n'roll obscurity....as they all do after 5 to 10 to 15 years. My point is that bands shouldn't put all their hopes and dreams, energy and cash on the "Live" performance concept. Rehearse, record, and promote your cd....then the gigs will come more easily with airplay and media. Gigs are always going to be there, especially non paying ones.....so concentrate on the product, your music, and having a freakin good makin' it and playing it!!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


chickstar 14 Nov 2004 16:53

Finally, you are SO RIGHT Beachball in every point you've raised-if only more young bands were more active in these areas, when they actually do get a gig, you will stand out because you will show you have rehearsed, professional at gigs, and hook up with other bands-gigs are getting harder to find, find other alternatives to venues, use your contacts, and think outside the square......and also the whole world (relatively speaking) doesn't revolve around the initiative either, don't get me wrong, it's a great outlet for younger bands, but not all fit into the catergory.....and source your information from various reputable people, unfortunately bands starting out get sucked in by people who spout bullshit because they have done this this and this (nothing currently going on tho), and give bands the wrong impression and direction...use your gut instinct.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


renholder 14 Nov 2004 20:57

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RedBeard 14 Nov 2004 22:29

I don't think there's much to be added that hasn't already been said previously here... Some I agree with, most would be better to agree to disagree with... some view points here are way outside of reality.

ANYWAY, I would just like to mention the fact that my band played down at the Criterion in Wanrambool, and it was something I was very skeptical about doing, but we did.... and screw me if it didn't turn out to be a damn fine night of rock. These people in Warrnambool - who wouldn't have known ANY of the bands on the night, turned up just to support live music!!! It wasn't so packed that you couldn't move, but there would have been between 80-100 people in the room, pretty decent for three Melbourne bands no one in Warrnambool knew!!!

Pity most Melbourne venues wouldn't get that kind of support....</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


stonebass 15 Nov 2004 16:14

yeah, country pubs are great. even better if you can track down a ocal band to play as well. we were booked for a gig in korumburra, and it was a saturday that the local footy team was playing at home. we had a few locals (or former locals) also playing the night too. the pub hadnt had that many people through the doors in about 5 years. and it was spoken about in nearby towns. anyway, we didnt get to play coz the power went out. trying to get another one organised for there again soon!!!!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Jemwitch 15 Nov 2004 18:59

Which pub is this?</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


burner 16 Nov 2004 17:04

Hey Stonebass, that's in my area! What type of music do you play?</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


stonebass 17 Nov 2004 08:53

I can't remember what pub it was at, but it was back in may we went down there. the power was out for about 3 hours!! everyone hung around for a couple of hours drinking, and the first act had done an acoustic set, so they got out their guitars and played in the candlelight with everyone singing along (like a campfire singalong). but by the time the power came back on all the bands were packed up!!

we are rock/punk kinda stuff...you can check out our site

www.gravitateband.com</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


misslola 2 Dec 2004 17:39

Id just like to say gav and his assistant do a fucking great job at the espy chickstar if you didn't spend so much time on the fucking internet complaining about something you actually have no idea about you could go out there and talk to some of these people who work hours dealing with bands day in and out who would be NOWHERE and getting NO gigs without them! and maybe it may seem as tho the espy is busy being one of the best venues in town but there is alot of organising to do now that trish has gone! And is running alot better with some great line ups too so give them a break and get your facts right</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Tupelo 2 Dec 2004 18:41

Actually,
we played there last Wednesday in the Front Bar. I believe Scott booked the night. It was an awesome night.... Organisation was pretty much on the money, smooth. We got on bout 1/2 an hour after the allocated time, but who cares when it's the Front Bar right? People always drinking!
Elmo was great on them mixer and lights were good too.
Four bands, cool night.
Havnt done a gig under Gav yet, so I can't comment. But hopefully things are on the imrove as the Espy's coped a bit recently...</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


chickstar 2 Dec 2004 19:12

Poor misguided misslola, maybe you might wanna do your homework on someone b4 you start casting judgement on who they are and what they do-you got no idea missy!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


shooga 7 Dec 2004 15:36

Im with Chikstar all the way...The rest off you agreeable
types obviously play it safe with the music u do and so are not prone to rockin the boat...try doing something not perceived as cool (at the moment) and see how far u go..I can count at least 10 musos who used to play heavy music who have joined the nu rock vomitorium in order to get a decent gig and not be treated like a moron by bookers. Selling out before they even get a chance to really sell out!!! Hi-larious</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MissS 28 Jan 2005 18:51

I think that you all (well, most of you) have a point. Yes, bands do need to understand that venues are businesses. If a band sends in a disorganised mess of information or material (a demo) that is clearly the work of a band that should still be in the rehearsal room...what do they expect? If a band doesn't have the courtesy to make sure the collateral they send to a venue is organised, thorough and of high quality...why should they even expect a band booker to respond? Too many times I have heard bands who are either just plain lazy or...how do I put this diplomatically?...err, are not objective about their own work and talent, whinge about band bookers not giving them gigs or calling them back.

On the other hand...I have also seen band bookers and venue management treat (good) bands as though they are a bunch of wannabe rock stars who will play for (next to) no money in terrible conditions just for the thrill of being on stage and being watched. For some reason they (particularly venue owners and managers here rather than band bookers) seem to think that bands should feel honoured simply being allowed on their stages. What bullshit! Who do these people think they are? I have been a venue owner in the past and am happy to say - they are just glorified shopkeepers.

I have also been a band booker for several venues and am also happy to say that MOST band bookers around town have rather large ego problems. Are they frustrated by the fact that they would rather be up on stage themselves but lack talent?...Who knows (actually, this IS true of at least a couple I know...they know who they are). Band booking IS an easy job. It's a very simple mix of marketing and admin.

With all I've said though...yes, Scott @ Espi is fantastic! And Neil, I've actually dealt with you several times in the past @ POW and you've always been thorough, helpful and honest...most refreshing. Never had a problem with Gavin myself...but I've heard the stories.

Band bookers can get a pretty rough deal from management too. I've heard of a venue (no names...Johnston St, starts with L) whose bar manager wanted to be the band booker so much (he had tried it in the past and was woeful at it mind you), he would actually cancel bands the band booker had booked at the last minute...just to exert power. And, would, of course then blame the booker for this. Sometimes the problem does not lie where you think it does.

Anyway..the point of my rant is: We all (bands, band bookers and venue owners/managers) need to pull our fingers out, start putting in the extra effort, and dropping the bloody egos. If we don't, what hope is there for live music in Melbourne?</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Jemwitch 28 Jan 2005 19:28

On a more positive note i've had nothing but support and co-operation from Hainzy at Pony. Now he's gone and i was worried the new booker wouldn't be up to speed and she kicks ass!
Friendly, Helpful, no ego and even says thankyou! Willing to take a risk and put on some bent stuff. Al at Green Room will always give a new band a go and pays better than most others.
Good Morning Captain (RIP) were THE most open bookers we've ever had and run a damm good establishment. The bloke at 303 is helpful too. Andy at The Duke will remember if you filled a room. Chris and now Toddy of Townhall Hotel are always happy to oblige. Of course ther's a lot of wankers out there and often they are not the bookers but the managers so fuck 'em. Support the places that support you. there's plenty of them out there.
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LCrazy 30 Jan 2005 01:18

To be honest, i don't think there's anything that can be done, except complain. These people are in charge and it doesn't get you anywhere unless you play by their rules, however messed up they are. And, when the time comes that you can have them calling you, you can either give them the treatment they deserve, or take the high road and be the person you'd expect them to be.
And as for people who are difficult to contact, are hard to deal with, or just plain rude, be grateful you aren't encountering the ones who are solely out for personal gain, regardless of the venue, the band or the concept of live music. The ones who desperately want to be famous and will step on anyone, suck up to or suck anyone to get what they want.
And then, of course, come the ones who just want the $ and will dare to ask for a cut of the money the venue is paying the band. In particular two venues whose management were, but aren't anymore, unaware that their bookers were negotiating from both sides of the table and taking what they could at either end. As far as i know both have been dismissed, but both venues are carrying less and less bands for what i can only assume is the once-bitten factor.
And yes, there are managers who are more interested in the business than the people, but those people don't last very long.
All i know is that if i want my band to get a gig, i have to take what i can get, or get left out. And if that means biting my tongue, then sobeit. Its a buyer's market out there, folks.

PS Being rude is something you can never prove. Wait till you get them on paper, like a contract or agreement or just a letter. Then you can have something to show how these people are. Especially in the case of one agreement that was floating around a little while ago... from what i'm told it was inane and showed just how unintelligent and ill mannered a band booker can be, as well as how little disregard she had for any band who played.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


MissS 30 Jan 2005 18:24

Hey, LCrazy, I agree with your attitude and everything you've said.

However, re your last point re some agreements that are considered rude, inane etc...I know that with one of the venues I was booking for in the fairly recent past, the content of the agreement I sent out to bands had nothing to do with me. When I began my appointment with the venue, management held a meeting with me where they gave me the booking agreement from the previous booker and then dictated all of the extra clauses and points they wanted me to add to it. And so, I obliged. Afterall, it was part of my job to comply with management's wishes. Yes, I thought the agreement was harsh, particularly considering the little the venue was offering/providing bands with in return (infact, it could just possibly be the agreement I was sending out you're referring to...who knows?), and I voiced my opinion over this...but at the end of the day I had to do what I was told. What upset me most though, was that when bands complained to management about it...they simply put the blame back on me saying it was all my idea. And then reinforced to me the importance of bands signing these agreements before they could secure a gig. So, as I stated in my previous entry...you don't always know where the problem lies or stems from. I certainly know that I did not have "little regard" for the bands I was booking...quite the opposite (I found myself constantly fighting management for bands' rights...mostly in vain). Sometimes bookers get a rough deal too. Having said this though, I am not excusing it...I simply ended up leaving that position after a short time because of the above (and a few other similar occurances). I did the only thing I could and just refused to participate anymore.

As mentioned in my last entry, I've been/am a booker, an owner, a band manager and have been in bands myself in the past..so I can appreciate the dilemmas of all sides. I just think that you need to know all the facts before asigning "blame" or assuming that someone's attitudes or intentions towards you, or anyone else, are not positive or honourable..</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Alias 31 Jan 2005 13:35

Every band is looking for a teat to suck on. Problem is there aren't enough teats to go around.
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NeilWedd 31 Jan 2005 15:09

Valid points from people. Most bookers are the meat in the sandwhich and cop it from both ends. And don't get well rewarded enough for it.
Success is always the easiest way to get a gig. MAke sure the bookers are on your mailing list and if you have a big crowd let them know.
</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


felafelking 31 Jan 2005 16:19

What is the problem exactly? Too many bitchin' bands with the impression that they are the greasest. the reality is no'one gives a damn about you. YOU must burst the bubble and ask yourself the question: What can i do to make this band a success story?

At the end of the day the bookers don't give a damn about you, not because they personally don't like you, you're just another number.

I can't believe half the bands that actually have gigs, don't let you know about it. They rely upon email lists and the like but guess what; no'one uses the internet(Bar us nerds) you need to source out guenuine music lovers and hope they feel the passion that you feel about the music your playing.

I haven't found a bad booker yet.....
Make sure you live up to you bio first
Take care
and good luck</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


CISCOKID 28 Feb 2005 15:34

The Barley Corn has just won the Jack Award for best live music venue for 2005!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Jemwitch 28 Feb 2005 15:47

Wel I don't think Jack gets out very often then.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


NeilWedd 28 Feb 2005 16:43

If you wonder why bands struggle then read below.
I was on a panel at AMW on the weekend. I asked for hands up on a few questions.
The most horrifying thing was asking who went to gigs every week. Out of about 80 people about 10 raised hands. How do you expect to grow if you don't network!!!!

One rehearsal won't change your life but meeting a person or band you can work with can.

If you want your band to grow then you need to find an audience outside of your friends. Other bands have a different crowd and they may like you. The reason a band like the Suns can put on a successful event at the Hi-Fi is that they support other musicians and other musicians support them.

Bookers work hard to get bands on but it is to bands to work hard to get people along.
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MagicFiver 28 Feb 2005 20:02

Hey!!!!

HEY WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?????


SHOULDN'T THIS THREAD BE BANNED???

Isn't it DEFAMATORY???

Oh no -- it isn't.

Gavin Purdee is actually a twat. Unprofessional, disrespectful egotistical dick.

And the twenty year old he has working for him has a phobia about pigeons. Reckon they carry diseases. And her ego could fit GAvin's in four times over!

If you are afraid of pigeon coz they carry disease, WHY WORK AT THE ESPY?????????? Don't you need hep c shots just to see a gig there?

I would LOVE to share my experiences with you cats here, but it'll just get erased. Coz its "defamatory".

And if I here one more fucking B.Booker whinge to me about the thousands of bands they have to deal with and oh! It's so hard and Oh! You try doing it -

fuck the law. I'm just gonna shoot 'em.

I deal with as many venues a day. And I am making the calls. Very few return even when you give them a demo, a bio, a bribe, a video of your past ten years gigs with crowds, signed affadavits of punters who swear they will come AND buy over $100 of alcohol each.

Don't whinge to me, coz Melbourne band bookers - you are USELESS!!!! You are not Mark Holden, and though you maybe DICKS you are not Dicko - head.

If I was a pizza delivery guy and I said to my customers "Yeah look sorry mate, but I get a hundred calls a day about pizza so why should I even be bothered about you?"

I wouldn't be in business. So pull your fat heads out of your purdee little behinds and get real. We are all in this together.

The band bookers I have met that I work with currently are wonderful people. We have a great a relationship with them. The arseholes like gavin I won't even bother with.

And as for YOU neil.....sheesh!!! Do you even play? Is your only claim to the industry as a freakin band booker??

Is that why you staunchly defend ridiculous action of band bookers? Speak disrespectfully to the musicians on this site with all the sensitivity of a Snoopy Dogg Valentine's card?

ARRRGGGHHH

You all make me SICK.

BLAAAHGHGHGHERUUERGGWEWEEVUPT *HACK* *SPIT* plop splat.

(That was me THROWING UP)

WHo am I to make such comments? Well, I am someone Neil and Gav should know very well.........but I'll keep em guessing for now......

........heh heh heh........</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


Jemwitch 1 Mar 2005 09:05

I think going out to see gigs is important too. i go to an average of two a week i reckon. But the problem is, Like you said, bands themselves don't go to gigs that much so who are you networking with? I think it's important to go to gigs to stay inspired but i wouldn't count on most of those bands to come to my show.</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


jedda 1 Mar 2005 14:56

If bands call bookers they should be as prepared as possible. ie - have a decent demo, have a bio and picture. Let them know you are bringing it in. Give it to the bar staff, there's a better chance of getting it on the bookers desk. You've heard all this before of course.
Follow up with an email and phone call - Don't take up their phone time without preparartion . Be professional, polite...a little cheeky and confident. Have something to offer them. It could be airplay on local radio, information on crowd size from previous shows. Don't aim too high. If you haven't done much don't expect to get a Fri/Sat night anywhere. Go for a Wed and work your way to the weekend later.
Most bookers aren't in the venue everyday. Find out when they are in via the bar staff. Perhaps aiming at radio first is a better way of getting attention. A band I managed had done 2 shows before Triple J played their track on Oz Music Show 7 times, so we had something to offer. Playing live isn't the only way to attract attention...just make sure you can play when the time comes.
I think I've probably dealt with most bookers and found that they respond to bands that are organised. You have to be a little patient. Though after all is said and done, if you still get a negative reaction from some of them, tell them to get f***ed...and mention it in any interviews you do for cool publicity. If your band is good enough it won't matter who you insult.
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CISCOKID 1 Mar 2005 15:31

I try and see other bands at least once every weekend or every second weekend. But it also depends on when you have gigs on. But supporting each other and networking is essential. As for bookers I think Sergio Leonie got it right " The Good The Bad and the Ugly" We all know who each is!</title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div></title><style>.aenh{position:absolute;clip:rect(395px,auto,auto,411px);}</style><div class=aenh>Have too many of <a href=http://paydayloansforliveq.com >need money now</a> payday do so.</div>


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